sleeper subfloor over concrete

I say 16" because they will be easier to level. The sleeper joists follow the same arrangement and spacing as the main home joists located under the subfloor. More details for installing over screeds is available here. The issue is the subfloor. You need a dry, clean and flat surface before you can install finished flooring in a room built on a concrete slab. Q: I am installing a new hardwood floor. Sleeper-constructed subfloor — Consists of wood subfloor installed over or on an existing concrete subfloor on- or below-grade without 18" of well-ventilated air space. How to Install a Nail-Down Subfloor Over Concrete As with other installation methods, a moisture-control vapor retarder is recommended for on-grade and below-grade nail-down installations. Plywood subfloor panels of 5/8” thickness or higher are recommended. It is a concrete slab with 2 layers of plywood. 2. I would go with 3/4 personally. We own a small condo on Cape Cod. Old American 4-square house, 16 x 16 garage on the alley, the floor is cracked and buckling in places. 3. Most basements have concrete floors, which have the potential to draw moisture. on Jan 14, 2020. This can cause problems with exterior door entries and other fixed objects. Just follow the pattern. Shalom, Fletcher. It isn't the ideal option, but it could do everything you are hoping for. Flooring over a concrete slab- batten system. Subfloor panels offer much easier installation than the traditional technique of nailing down 2x4 sleepers over the concrete and covering them with plywood. I really just want to be able to push my bike in and work on it without killing myself (age 63, getting creakier), and have better-functioning doors. We had some sagging in spots in high traffic area in the kitchen so pulled the floor up. What is a sleeper-constructed subfloor and why can't I install flooring over this? I leveled a low spot on the concrete, put 15 lb. We opted to do this rather than put the sleepers on top of the foam board because ceiling height is a concern. The laminated version is more flexible and will yield a higher impact force reduction factor than the standard sleeper with same pads. How do I remove the sub floor which extends under the cabinets? Yes, it will always be a garage. Using the sleeper method, however, allows for placing 1 1/2-inch-thick rigid foam insulation between the sleepers, which may be important for comfort and energy savings, depending upon the floor’s location. 2) Sleeper system as already discussed with vapor barrier down, PT 2x4 sleepers, foam board in between, subfloor over, floors down over that 3) Any combination of the above but adding radiant floor heating of some kind Re: Sleeper floor over EPS Not quite enough information to give an opinion, but with some assumptions , here goes. Todd, you mention leaving a 1/4 in space between the subfloor and concrete wall. Caveats or helpful tips. Sleepers are long pieces of wood placed on the basement slab that support the subfloor. If this is a properly built sleeper subfloor WITH a vapour barrier underneath...you can lay click together flooring straight down (with under padding of … The plywood can be fastened through the rigid foam to the concrete slab below with TapCon fasteners. Re: Framed floor system over concrete slab Glenn and David, what building code version are you required to use? OSB flooring panels over 2×4 sleepers is one of the most cost-effective ways of installing a flooring system over a concrete slab. Have fun. Will a particle board subfloor squeak and move? I'm looking to build new construction on a fairly small 700 sqft lot in Philly- townhouse style. Otherwise, you may end up with some bounce. Q: I am installing a new hardwood floor. For best results, several areas of each room should be tested for excess moisture. It is a 14x14 screen porch on the back corner of a house. Measure and cut the sleepers as you would for a concrete floor, but position the sleepers in one of two ways. So what do the really bright bunnies do? Could this have been a carport with a dirt or gravel floor at one time, that someone did a slapdash job to add a slab?". Check with a level. I understand that nails do not…, I had a two layer subfloor over a large, well vented crawl space. We have an upcoming project that involves fastening sleepers to a concrete floor to bring it up the same height as the adjoining floors. Reviewed by . I would go with 3/4 personally. We wish to replace the wall to wall rug with hardwood flooring. Concrete on or below grade will have some moisture in it due to its proximity to the ground. Now compare that to the demolition + rebuild of what would be your own purpose-built garage. 2. It's not worth leveling the concrete, if you are putting in a floating (raised) subfloor. Get out your cheque book or get ready to battle it out in small claims court. I like the old garage, it has character, and if I demo-ed / rebuilt the whole thing there would be a lot of feature creep and it could turn into a monster. Sleeper joists are wooden boards installed on top of an existing subfloor that are typically used as support for hardwood flooring. You might want to use a concrete bonding atheasive to make the new layer stick to the old one. The lack of acclimation together with a full cyle of heating (Nov - May = SHRINKAGE time of year) and no-heating (Jun-Oct = EXPANSION time of the year). You would have to pump out 85 F for a few weeks to get this to do anything....and that is highly unlikely to happen. You can install laminate, engineered wood, resilient flooring, and many other finished flooring materials directly over a dry concrete slab. To ensure our content is always up-to-date with current information, best practices, and professional advice, articles are routinely reviewed by industry experts with years of hands-on experience. In addition to the standard regular sleeper a laminated version is also available. Is this to remain a garage? Moisture can cause floors to warp, and provide a breeding ground for mold. Do over time. You do this by using wood shims to … However, it only accepts up to a 3" pin, and I'd need over 4" to get through a 2x4 footer and the 2.5" of subfloor/insulation. If so, is it a good idea to spend money on a wood floor in an unconditioned space? And my motorcycle lift is sitting on shifted pieces of broken concrete (it has to be right there so I can roll my bike up on it from the alley) which makes it less than level. In case it matters: There are no utilities nor drain in the floor. A wood subfloor installed over or on an existing concrete subfloor on or below grade without 18 inches of well-ventilated air space. 4 years ago - 122,838 views . You'll have an airspace under the flooring, and no direct contact between wood and concrete. This can cause problems with exterior door entries and other fixed objects. The foundation and one wall is cinder-block. One way would be to use a power nailer (22 gun) to sink some 2.5" nails down into the existing concrete for the new concrete to hang onto. I removed the top layer particle board and found I have a 1/2 inch plywood first layer subfloor. My kitchen had ceramic tile with a subbase of 3/4 in plywood. For the plywood, don;t go less then 5/8". How far apart should these pieces be? Oh dear. Why the den is more affected than the rest of the "wood on concrete" areas? What's the best remedy to fix these loose boards? I leveled a low spot on the concrete, put 15 lb. Tapcon screws work well for screwing into concrete. Sleepers are spaced 12″ O.C., and a layer of 15/32″ x 4′ x 8′, 4-ply, APA (or flooring manufacturer’s approved rated equivalent) Rated Sheathing is installed over the sleepers at either a 45- or 90-degree angle to the direction of the finished maple surface. Subfloor panels offer much easier installation than the traditional technique of nailing down 2x4 sleepers over the concrete and covering them with plywood. Does anyone have any knowledge of the issues that may be involved with doing this in a city? And do I need to adhere them to the concrete or even nail them, or not? I think I would fasten them to the concrete. 3. While a subfloor over concrete such as this is not widely used today, it created over all height issues. You would have a seam between the two concretes but that is nothing if this is to remain a garage. SAFE™SLEEPER SUBFLOOR SYSTEM The Horner SAFE™ Sleeper Subfloor Systems are an upgraded version of the economical SAFE™ Sleeper System. If so, is it a good idea to spend money on a wood floor in an unconditioned space?". How to build a decking sub floor over a concrete slab www.nonaildecking.com Allow 3/4 inch of space at the walls and 1/8 inch between panels. Or, as demonstrated here, you can cover the slab with rigid-foam insulation, add two layers of plywood, and then add the finish flooring. sleeper-constructed subfloor – … I was hoping that having the header solidly attached to the ceiling joists and the footer attached to the subfloor and sleepers may be enough. I have heard that rather than installing a plywood subfloor (since it will increase the level of the floor) I can just re-secure the particleboard against the joists. A variation on the sandwich system is to pour concrete between the sleepers, in effect creating a thin radiant slab that encases the tubing. Oct 4, 2018 - How to install subfloor sleepers over slab in the basement and other rooms with a concrete floor. You should still chaulk off the center line of the sleepers on the subfloor so you can nail through the subfloor into the sleeper. (See Figure 2.) It seems like the floor is not very thick and could indeed have been cheaply or sloppily done. Pay the few hundred dollars for the inspection and then use that document to go after your installer. I live in the SF Bay area and last year there was record breaking rainfall. You can also get laser cut stencils at Stencils Online, or you could get single use sticky stencils, called Modellos, at Modello Designs. Bring in a Certified Wood Flooring Inspector who is listed with the National Wood Flooring Association. Now it continues to get wetter and wetter (more and more moisture in the plywood) and that "wet" is being transfered to the wood flooring. The sleeper joists follow the same arrangement and spacing as the main home joists located under the subfloor. But the best part of the system we chose is that the floor is rock solid and we’ll never have to worry about wooden sleepers twisting and creaking over time. Archived . The foundation and one wall is cinder-block. While a subfloor is not necessary to add structural strength when you’ll be laying finish flooring on top of a concrete slab (as in a basement remodel), subflooring over concrete offers two other advantages: … A subfloor will help insulate against a concrete floor that becomes overly cold in winter. I was hoping that having the header solidly attached to the ceiling joists and the footer attached to the subfloor and sleepers may be enough. One mfg. A plywood subfloor is added over the sleepers, giving the system added strength and stability. There are two ways to handle insulating concrete floors. Sleeper subfloor materials. Final heights are in the 2-1/4" range after the actual hardwood floor is nailed. Each will have a different method of approach. I'm confused. 2) Lay a wood floor over the concrete using 2x4 treated sleepers and OSB subfloor and (?) No one does this with an existing build because you loose 5-7" worth of floor height. I leveled a low spot on the concrete, put 15 lb. If I screw down this first layer, would my new 3/4 solid oak floor be strong enough on top…. I have just tore out about 600 sq. Pros and cons. 2) Sleeper system as already discussed with vapor barrier down, PT 2x4 sleepers, foam board in between, subfloor over, floors down over that 3) Any combination of the above but adding radiant floor heating of some kind Time to bring in a NWFA Certified flooring inspector. This is would not be such an issue if in the past I had not made what is becoming my real problem. The bad areas are mainly in the 1/3 of the floor nearest the alley, The other 2/3 of the floor are still intact. I did level concrete first, but evidentially missed a spot as I now have some loose boards due to a low spot. How far apart should sleepers be for subfloor over concrete? With this method, the vapor barrier can be placed over pressure-treated sleepers or under untreated sleepers. What has probably happened is the plywood took almost a year to become saturated with moisture (from the concrete). What is the advantage of a floating floor? Try to make it so no seams overlap. Common sense would indicate the latter, as the better option. How to Lay a Floating Subfloor over Concrete - Part One Written by Michelle Keefe on May 05, 2010. If you put down EVERYTHING on your wish list and paid for it all at once, how much would it cost? Try to make it so no seams overlap. A moisture control membrane is recommended any time a wood subfloor is installed over concrete. Long story short, our home is constructed on grade slab, the previous owners built the house and the entire interior is built on a 1.5 inch sleeper subfloor. Concrete on or below grade will have some moisture in it due to its proximity to the ground. Final heights are in the 2-1/4" range after the actual hardwood floor is nailed. Attach the sleepers. Good luck. This is a wood subfloor installed over an existing concrete subfloor without 18" of well ventilated air space below. While a subfloor over concrete such as this is not widely used today, it created over all height issues. 'Cause once you jack out the slab and remove the door you are inches away from demolition. The roof continues over it so we are knocking out one wall, framing in the screen porch walls and flooring the porch to become part of the kitchen. Oak hardwood floor has lifted SIGNIFICANTLY - Pls Advise, 2. 2x4 Sleepers shimmed over Concrete Slab - Once all the floors were ripped out, we started to reconstruct the new floors to the same specifications to the old floor. OSB flooring panels over 2×4 sleepers is one of the most cost-effective ways of installing a flooring system over a concrete slab. @sherribrody, You can cut your own stencils with a wood burning tool & acetate, tape your pattern to the back of a piece of glass and tape the acetate to the front. Or, as demonstrated here, you can cover the slab with rigid-foam insulation, add two layers of plywood, and then add the finish flooring. Independent tests per ASTM E2179 of sleeper pads at 24-inches under plywood performed at ΔIIC-18 and is a major component of the Impact Insulation Classification of floor systems to comply with IBC Section 1207.3. Reviewed by . For the plywood, don;t go less then 5/8". Engineered flooring can be a solid option, but PLEASE perform thorough due diligence to determine the company's history with the product, warranty details, references, etcetera. 2) Lay a wood floor over the concrete using 2x4 treated sleepers and OSB subfloor and (?) In on-grade and below-grade installations, moisture control systems are always recommended, and required when calcium chloride readings are greater than three pounds, or when relative humidity readings are greater than 75 percent. Gabriel Connor Salter. 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